Shanna 0:11
Hello, welcome to the Adventist HealthCare & You podcast. I'm Shanna.

Nimeet 0:14
And I'm Nimeet.

Shanna 0:15
Today we have two very, very special guests with us to discuss colorectal cancer. We have Dr. Courtney Ackerman, a medical oncologist with the White Oak Cancer Center. Welcome, Dr. Ackerman.

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 0:27
Thanks for having me.

Shanna 0:28
Thank you. And we have one of her patients, Miss Lisa Smith, who is a colorectal cancer survivor. And is a patient at the White Oak Cancer Center. So we are really appreciative of you coming in and talking with us and sharing your story taking time out of both of your days to be here.

Lisa Smith 0:50
Well, I appreciate you having me here today.

Shanna 0:53
Thank you. All right, well, let's get kind of right into it. Lisa, you kind of came to us in a different way. We saw you at an event and you came up and introduced yourself and talked a little bit about your story. We thought it would be great to have you kind of come in and talk to our listeners in the community about your story. You're eager to share it. So I'm gonna let you start. Tell us how you found yourself at the White Oak Cancer Center. And in your experience.

Lisa Smith 1:19
Well, in 2020, it was time for me to have a colonoscopy. I'd had one 10 years prior. And it was time to do it again. Honestly, I did not want to do it again. Chadwick Boseman, had passed away, yes, some months earlier. And I, I was like, his death was not in vain. And I said, You know what, you really need to go. And so I did. November 2020, I had the colonoscopy, December 2nd, I had surgery. And on Christmas Eve, December 2020. I was diagnosed with colon cancer.

Shanna 2:05
Not something at the holidays. So in your but you're here. And you're you're telling your story. What happened next?

Lisa Smith 2:13
After that, after the surgeon told me I had colon cancer, he gave me four providers. He said pick one. And I said, okay sir, what do I do with the news that you just gave me? And he said, Miss Smith, he said, you're a woman of faith, right? I said, yes, I am. He said, well, he said, you hold on to your faith because it's going to carry you through and pick one of these providers. And so I didn't know any of them. I'm not from Maryland. I moved up here from South Carolina. But I read their bios, I prayed over all of the providers. And I asked God, I said, please put me with someone who cares about Lisa. And so I called Maryland Hematology Oncology, the receptionist or the appointment clerk, whoever answered they were very kind. And they said, oh, we have an appointment tomorrow. And I said, okay, and they said, you have an appointment with Dr. Ackerman. And I said, okay, and that's when the office was still off of Plum Orchard.

Shanna 3:27
Yep, before it moved to the White Oak Cancer Center.

Lisa Smith 3:29
Yes. And that's how I got there. When I got there. I was shocked. There was a lot of people in the waiting room. And I thought to myself, goodness, we all have cancer. And I think that's when it became real to me. So I got there, they took me back. I met Dr. Ackerman. She spoke to me. She explained that I had stage three colon cancer. She explained the treatment, the medicine that I would be taking, She explained that I would still be able to work. And she explained that I could drag myself back and forth to my appointments. And I told her I said I prayed over you. And she said, you and me we're going to be okay.

Shanna 4:29
Well we've talked a lot about on the podcasts, the relationship between a person and their doctor, whether its primary care or another type of physician and how that you really do need to have a relationship and that it's a special relationship. It's long term.

Nimeet 4:43
Yeah, and I think that's very beneficial to have that and you go into Dr. Ackerman and having that created for you was was highly beneficial. So Dr. Ackerman, how did you create that safe space for Lisa or any other patient?

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 4:55
You know, I think that oncology in particular is a very unique field, where it's really important to kind of see the whole person, and not just what their disease is and to really get to know them, and you know, what's important to them what they value, what they're scared of what you know, just look at the whole picture, and it's one of the really unique things about oncology is you get to kind of really build this long term relationship with the patient, you know, you get to know their family, and, you know, their hobbies, and what's important to them. And I think taking that interest in the whole person is really what creates that relationship, and allows you to not only heal their cancer, but heal the whole person.

Shanna 5:40
Heal them totally, because it affects your entire your entire life physically, emotionally, spiritually, it affects everything,

Nimeet 5:50
Yeah, I think the wholeness approach is crucial, and any patient physician relationship and, you know, definitely in the cancer patients, and I think, Lisa, when you first received the news, you were, you know, sort of confused, you're like, okay, what now? What do I do? And you know, and this is this person just telling you this news that you were, you know, shocked by and not expecting it.

Lisa Smith 6:11
And that's the truth. Because when he when he told me, I'm going to be honest with you, I had no signs, no symptoms, no nothing. I was not expecting what I heard. When I heard it. I said, God, what do I do? Do I tear up his office? And I looked around and I said, well, he really doesn't have too much in the office. And, and that's when I asked him, you know, what do I do with the news that you gave me? And so, you know, when he said what he said, I got in my car, I got home. A good, good friend of mine called me. I said, hello. And then she said something, and I just started crying. I just started crying, and I kept crying. And she said, I don't know what happened, or what's going on with you. She said, but whatever it is, it's going to be okay. I immediately stopped crying. And we finished the conversation. I got off the phone. And I said, okay God, I have a choice to make. I can mope and I can say woe is me. Or I can stand on my faith. I know how I was raised and what I was taught. And I said, today, I choose to stand on my faith.

Nimeet 7:34
Yeah, and the faith clearly assisted you throughout throughout the journey, and got you to Dr. Ackerman, and in the future. So, um, talk to us about your journey at White Oak Cancer Center, particularly, you know, after you met Dr. Ackerman and had your initial appointment. Talk to us about your journey after.

Lisa Smith 7:52
Okay, well, after after we had that initial visit. You know, she suggested I get a port. And I was, I said to myself, more surgery. And I was also remember, you gotta remember, this is in the height of the pandemic.

Shanna 8:13
Of COVID. Yes.

Nimeet 8:14
Oh, you're right, it was 2020, you were saying.

Lisa Smith 8:16
I was already prepared to get a COVID shot. But I was going to wait and see what happened with other people. And Dr. Ackerman, she said, well, with the situation that you're in, it would be good for you to get it now instead of waiting. And so I did that. So I got the port placed. I got the COVID shot. And so I went to my first appointment at the old place, it was very small. I was very, very, very scared. If he, if he coughed, I was going to jump out of my skin. My nurse Lyda, I told her I said and I'm scared. I'm really scared. And they were moving. They were like in the process of moving.

Shanna 9:05
Yeah, that was in that in between period between before you transitioned over to the, the new space.

Lisa Smith 9:11
They had a room that looked like it was a storage closet. But there was a chair in there. And she said, Lyda said, Would you be okay here? And I was like, yes. So you know she explained everything to me my meds a you know, tell me the meds. They check my name, my birthdate and she say you make sure, every time, no matter who's your nurse you make sure they do this, this and this. I said okay, so she taught me a lot. When I got to the new facility. OMG!

Shanna 9:15
It is beautiful.

Lisa Smith 9:48
OMG, it was, tadahhh!

Shanna 9:51
So much, I think thought and consideration went into the space at the White Oak Cancer Center to make it, a healing place. And the other place was too, healing happened there all the time. But real thought and heart went into.

Lisa Smith 10:10
And I can say that because it was so much bigger, you had room and again, I was still very, very scared and nervous. And I believe the nurses saw that. And so one of the nurses, she said Miss Smith, she said, I spoke to the appointment clerk, she's like, when you come back, we're gonna have you go into this room, these, they had these three rooms on the side, and you could see the sky, you could see the clouds and other buildings. And so every time I came after that, they, that's where they put me, and I felt better.

Shanna 10:51
Good. That's wonderful. Dr. Ackerman, since we're talking about the transition to the White Oak Cancer Center, what makes it so special, you know, she's talking about the space and a lot of thought went into that. What else is special about the the Cancer Center that is makes it such a healing place?

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 11:08
So I think it's, you know, it was a huge undertaking. And we really spent like a year and a half, building it and thinking about every single detail. And I was part of that team that did that. But I think the fact that it's has very calming colors and calming light and the fact that we can have different scenarios for different patients. So some patients like the community of sitting in the infusion center and having neighbors close by that they can talk to and get to know. And other patients like to be more private and have their own space and kind of be separated for risk of being afraid of infection and things like that. So we really, were able to offer all of those options for patients because it's not one size fits all, you know, people need different things. Yes, I have other patients, I have another colorectal cancer patient actually that he became really good friends with another patient just from sitting next to him and infusion and they became buddies and they would line their appointments up next to each other because they really enjoyed seeing each other every two weeks when they came for treatment. So it's really the ability to have whatever that particular patient needs, you know, we can be flexible and we can offer different things. I think the other things that make it a really great place to receive care is that we have everything under one roof. So we have PET scan in the same building. We have radiation oncology in the same building. We have breast surgeons, GYN oncologists, nutritionists, social worker, you know, we have all these extra services, you know, financial counselors. We now have added palliative care where we have you know, all these different services that patients can get all under one roof. You know, the nutritionist, she can come and meet with patients while they're getting their chemo. So they don't have to make a separate appointment. They can kind of pass the time while they're already there.

Shanna 13:17
Yep. And and it treats the whole person.

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 13:19
Absolutely.

Nimeet 13:20
You know, getting healthcare appointments is always challenging and going to different places for different, you know, maybe it's a CAT scan or a consultation. Having that all under one roof. And at the same appointment is so valuable,

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 13:32
Absolutely.

Lisa Smith 13:33
Very, very valuable. Because I can tell you there were some days. I don't even know honestly how I made it there. And I only lived eight minutes away. And to have everything under one roof, that I could get the different services. I can honestly tell you - it made a difference.

Shanna 13:56
Yes.

Lisa Smith 13:59
It made a difference. I had spoken with the social worker. I had spoken with Miss Dorcest, the nutritionist. And I think that's one of the great things about the Maryland Hematology Oncology is that you do have everything there, under one roof.

Shanna 14:21
Yeah, it made it a little easier to navigate and and walk through.

Lisa Smith 14:27
Yes.

Nimeet 14:28
And it's nice that it's not one size fit all and you know, having those different various options for each patient catering to each patient is valuable. I know Dr. Ackerman, you mentioned that, you know, their peer support was benefited for certain patients, but that social aspect of it. What kind of support for you Lisa was beneficial during this whole process?

Lisa Smith 14:47
Well, I'm not here by myself. My family is pretty much in South Carolina. My daughters are in Florida. And just, you know, I, I'm pretty much by myself, but I had to open up a little bit and, you know, I relied on my, my co-workers, my sorority, and just like I said, the nurses and the staff at the Center, they were just so kind, so caring, so empathetic. I mean, from when you walked in the door, and that's a hi, how can I help you? And I'm Lisa Smith, I have an appointment. And then you know, and then you went to the lab. Just everyone there, to me, is just so supportive in every step in every aspect. And they're teaching you at the same time. You know, they're there, they're giving you this caring and kindness and empathy and that, I truly believe, that's what truly has helped me to get through. And even, I'm a survivor, and it's still the same when I go now.

Nimeet 16:05
Yeah, and I think it's so beneficial to have the process easy and smooth, right? Because nobody wants to go there. Nobody wants to be there, quite honestly. But when you're there and if there's any barriers, or if somebody's rude, or is it something like that that occurs, you know, it just deters the whole environment for you.

Lisa Smith 16:22
And it is never I can honestly tell you never, not one time we're talking about from the financial, to the lab, to the social worker to the nurse. Never, never. Anyone being rude.

Shanna 16:37
I'm so, I'm so, I'm sure Dr. Ackerman is so pleased to hear. Well, Lisa, what what made you want to tell your story and and share your experience? What do you want the community to know?

Lisa Smith 16:53
I think for a long time I was ashamed. I know that might sound crazy - you're ashamed you have cancer? But I felt that way. Maybe I didn't do this, or do that or do it in the right time. And I was like, okay, God has a plan for me. And I believe that he didn't want me to be quiet. For a long time, I did everything. I never missed an appointment. I did everything, get your PET scans and get this, get your CT scans. So I just and I don't think I ever really stopped to say, hey, you know what? You have cancer. And so, here it is almost two years later. I feel like I have, like, this is what God wants me to do. He wants, he wants me to share my story. So that I can hopefully help someone else to let them know, hey, no, it's not an easy journey. It's really not, and it's not a fun journey. But if you're with a facility that has kind, caring, empathetic doctors, you have to tell somebody your story. And hopefully you can be an inspiration. You can be a hope to say yes, I can get through this. And that's where I feel I'm at. That's why I'm doing this right now today is to tell people, please get checked. Please share your story. Because you don't know just somebody hearing me speak. Maybe I can help someone. And that's, that's what I want to do. And I feel that's my mission now. And I'm going to take the mantle, and I'm not going to be ashamed anymore. I used to keep saying, oh, I have cancer and and I went to one appointment. And they're like, okay, I thought you were in remission? And I'm like, I am a cancer survivor. So that's what I say now. I am a cancer survivor.

Shanna 17:20
What an, what an amazing story. And I heard in the very beginning when you said you had no symptoms. And you were just due for your your regular checkup. And I think that is so important for everybody, you know, starting at age 45. Right, Dr. Ackerman?

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 19:21
Absolutely.

Shanna 19:23
At age 45 men and women need to start getting their colonoscopies.

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 19:31
I think that's one of the biggest sort of myths about colorectal cancer is that people think, oh, I'm going to have pain or I'm going to have bleeding or there's going to be some sign so I don't need to do my colonoscopy because if something's wrong, there'll be a sign that something's wrong. And for some patients there is signs, but for a lot of patients there aren't. And you know, colorectal cancer is a highly curable cancer if it's caught in the early stages. And it's just, and you know, a lot of patients, if it's caught in the early stages, they may just need surgery and not even any chemotherapy. So it's just so important to get your colonoscopies and even if to do that routinely starting at age 45, I think a lot of people still think it's age 50. But it was lowered to 45. Because unfortunately, we have been seeing a lot of younger patients with colorectal cancer. And so they, you know, the national guidelines changed to lower that age to 45. But there's plenty of patients that are asymptomatic. And so it's important to really do the screening, even if you're not having symptoms.

Shanna 20:41
If you're feeling good, you're healthy, still do it.

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 20:44
Yes, absolutely.

Nimeet 20:45
Lisa, we think you're really brave of sharing your story. You know, I just want to thank you for doing that. Because if you could change one life or getting that one extra person to get that colorectal cancer check, or you know, colonoscopy as a normal routine, or I have the conversation about it with their provider, I think that would change many, many lives.

Lisa Smith 21:04
It will and, you know, I want to encourage all people to get checked, especially I'm African American and African American community. From my understanding, and please Dr. Ackerman if I'm wrong, please correct me. The incidences of African Americans getting colon cancer, it's very high. And so I just want to encourage, tell your mom, your dad, your cousin's, your auntie, your sorority sisters, your fraternity brothers. Truly, every body to please, please, please get checked. One of my good friends, she just had hers yesterday.

Shanna 21:50
That's great. All right. Well, I don't want to keep you ladies any longer. Any, any last thoughts that we that you want to share before we wrap up, Dr. Ackerman, anything?

Dr. Courtney Ackerman 22:02
Well, I just want to thank Lisa for coming on and for sharing with us her story. And I truly think it's so important. And it's important for patients to see people that are like them, in these stories, so that it can help them to relate. And I do think that the White Oak Cancer Center, we're doing a lot of great things to try and keep up with the latest and greatest treatments, but also providing that really healing, calming environment for patients.

Shanna 22:32
You have the latest and greatest, but you have to have that other side of that too. Absolutely.

Lisa Smith 22:36
And I agree with Dr. Ackerman, you know, at the White Oak Cancer Center, they treat the whole person. Like I said, my daughters weren't here. I asked Dr. Ackerman, can my daughter be on the phone? Can she speak to you? Can she ask questions? She said, sure. And I was like, okay, awesome. And my daughter was very happy when I rang the bell. They filmed it, so my daughters could see it. That was very important to me. I had a situation where they were having trouble getting the needle in the port. And Miss Louise. She is awesome. The whole lab is awesome. They had another nurse, they call her the angel whisperer or needle whisperer, I don't know. But she came in and Dr. Ackerman came out of her office and came to the lab. She didn't have to do that. But she did. And I appreciated it. The other thing is, I was having some issues with my job. And I spoke with Dr. Ackerman. She wrote notes to say, hey, my medical opinion. This patient needs to do this, this and this. She needs to be home. She can telework. And I thank her for supporting me for standing up for me. Because there was times I felt I couldn't stand for myself. But the encouragement and the care that I received and the uplift from the nurses. One nurse she left not too long after I had come, I think she moved back home. But she said Miss Smith, we are here to help you. She said but you have to tell us what's going on with you. How are you feeling? And she said I want you to speak up and I want you to speak out for your health. I said okay, I say you don't know what you just created. And now I speak up and I speak out and I will tell anybody in the DMV area. If you can come to the White Oak office or wherever, I know there's different offices. But this is a facility and providers who care, nurse practitioners, they really care about you, the whole you. They really want to see you get well and do well. And I am forever grateful that I was able to have my care there. I will continue to have my care there. If I moved back to South Carolina, I'll probably come back up here...

Shanna 25:40
You're going to be doing telehealth, Dr. Ackerman.

Lisa Smith 25:44
But it's. It means a lot. A lot to me, my words, just not, cannot express. Because there's some days we you thought you weren't going to make it through. But I was always encouraged. And that's what I want to do is encourage other people. Keep your faith. Keep your focus on God because I am not an easy stick when it comes to veins. And that was a calming for me just to focus on God. But yes, please get checked. Seek a facility and providers that care.

Shanna 26:22
Thank you. Thank you both for being here and, and sharing your story. And Dr. Ackerman, for being a part of that story of being such an amazing physician and being part of a group that provides such wonderful care. So we really appreciate you both. And you're very brave Miss, Miss Smith. Yes. All right. Well, thank you to everybody for joining and for listening. If you want to learn more about the White Oak Cancer Center and Dr. Ackerman, please visit WhiteOakCancerCenter.com. Don't forget to subscribe to our podcast so you get all of our new episodes. Thank you, and be well.